So I thought this would be a pretty crucial topic to discuss. There are so many products out there its hard to know what to use and what not to use.
So I`m 100% new to veganics but have listened to kyle on Free Weed and read a lot of his stuff by High Times.
So let me start.
I read the 420 article by Kyle and wrote a list of what nutrients he mentions. However, I`m not 100% sure how his feeding schedule works. So hopefully he can chime in on that.
The List.
Nutrients
Bio vega
Bio Flora
Humboldt Bloom (0-10-0)
Soluble seaweed (Technafloras) ~
General Organic CaMag
Bio Boost
enzymatic
mineral matirx micros ~
MICRO
Humboldt Nutrients Myco Madness – SOLUBLE
Plant Success – GRANULAR
Humboldt Mayan Microzyme – Tea
Honey ES
So whats your recommended feeding schedule?
Lastly are there going to be any possible test samples or early releases we can try? I just got my taxse and doing a grow room make over and want to try some veganics out.
Whew, it’s a tall order to tell you how to feed with these nutrients. I’ve heard the Bio line from Canna has been discontinued. Probably becuause they needed help. I spent 2 years working out how to amend the Canna Bio line for high yield production. It’s what led me to create my own nutrients. They have been in development for about 2 years now and they’re scheduled to be released some time this year. Hopefully around summertime.
Until then I suggest trying the Natures Nectar line of organic nutrients. They employ much of the same plant fermented technologies that Canna used. Even the (P)Phosphorous supplement which says derived from fossilized bat guano on the label actually qualifies as veganic. Becuase the material is fossilized to begin with, then purified to a clear odorless liquid, it more closely resembles lignite under chemical analysis. It’s a dead liquid as far as microbes are concerned. Only the mineral content remains.
Have some CaMg on hand for heavy growth weeks and high yield situations. Of coarse, microbial teas and/or innocculants are crucial(www.ogTea.com). Using the Humboldt Bloom 0-10-0 and Technafloras Soluable Seaweed(I think theirs is the best) for your bloom boost period. Using Thrive Alive throughout as a general intermittant tonic will also help.
Bring me some more questions as you think of them.
Here’s a shot of my Alpha Dawg(Blue Dream x Stardawg) on Day 38…:-)
Awesome response.
I`m so glad you brought up Nectar of the Gods. My local shop sells it and i`ve heard nothing but positive feedback….done and done….there is not alot of information or review or grow pics useing the line. Have you ran that line and have any pics?
Question – Humbolts Prozyme and Hygrozyme. Whats your 2 cents on it? worth the addition or no?
Adding to the questinos. is it worth to buy if your geting the nectar for the gods line? or is there something they have already? Thanks
Sorry to burst your bubble but I said Natures Nectar, not Nectar of the Gods…Yes, an enzymatic product is necessary. Either works well, hygrozyme maybe a little better…:-)
Is it prudent to use both enzymatic products in conjunction? Like 5ml each Prozyme and Hygrozyme in veg working up to 10ml+ for heavy flowering?
Yes, the two enzymes work very well together. I suggest feeding 10ml of each during chunk time…:-)
Quote:
Quote from Kushman on February 23, 2013, 17:41
Whew, it’s a tall order to tell you how to feed with these nutrients. I’ve heard the Bio line from Canna has been discontinued. Probably becuause they needed help. I spent 2 years working out how to amend the Canna Bio line for high yield production. It’s what led me to create my own nutrients. They have been in development for about 2 years now and they’re scheduled to be released some time this year. Hopefully around summertime.
Until then I suggest trying the Natures Nectar line of organic nutrients. They employ much of the same plant fermented technologies that Canna used. Even the (P)Phosphorous supplement which says derived from fossilized bat guano on the label actually qualifies as veganic. Becuase the material is fossilized to begin with, then purified to a clear odorless liquid, it more closely resembles lignite under chemical analysis. It’s a dead liquid as far as microbes are concerned. Only the mineral content remains.
Have some CaMg on hand for heavy growth weeks and high yield situations. Of coarse, microbial teas and/or innocculants are crucial(www.ogTea.com). Using the Humboldt Bloom 0-10-0 and Technafloras Soluable Seaweed(I think theirs is the best) for your bloom boost period. Using Thrive Alive throughout as a general intermittant tonic will also help.
Bring me some more questions as you think of them.
Here’s a shot of my Alpha Dawg(Blue Dream x Stardawg) on Day 38…:-)
Question to my fellow veganic growers… I am in Canada & The Bio-Canna line is still being sold out here. If you are using the complete Bio Line from Canna such as (Bio-vega,flores,rhizo,zyme,boost & the bio terra plus), would you still recommend “TEA” feeds between feedings?… Don’t want to overfeed the lady’s or do any harm to them but still trying to get the most out of my grows. Thanks in advance & glad to see everything is up & running.
Hell yeah! I reccomend using tea for EVERY feeding. Tea is only a tiny dose of food, it’s not meant to be. It’s purely to continuously re-innocculate the soil with beneficial microbes. The microbes supercharge your root-soil foodweb making your nutrients more effective. So you can actually do more with less…:-)
Yess! I’m getting caught up ..I can use general organics in place of bio canna.if I am using og microbial tea I no longer have to use the bountea system?if I am not using bio boost what go product is replacing it?
Kyle witch nutes are to be used alone for example can bountea be mix with your nutes or a stand alone fert.and can u listed them thank you
And when should I use genral hydroponics mineral magic nutes I’m using the bio canna and the bio terra plus soil
You can most def mix nutes into the bountea. As for OG Microbial replacing bountea I think it actually only replaces Myco Madness. The bountea is great for foliar spray or mixing nutes in, it is a microbial tea creating a root soil food web and when foliar spraying a biofilm on your girls to protect them inside and out. Inoculate every watering through around 3-4 week of flower then cut it back to once a week through flush.
Kook thanks dude and use the bountea and myco madness soluable every watering till 3-4 mark of flowering then break for week then again then flush and I thought u should only use bountea say every other week till the 3-4 week?.and does anyone know a good nute mix for mother plants?
GREENBEARD is giving good advice. THANKS
Mother plants should be fed according to the strength of the light they’re under. Full strength veg nutes for HID. Half strength for T-5 Floros…:-)
Yup, thankz green beard! Good because I really do like bountea,
Wow didn’t know about the t-5s and hid lighting feed cool and my natures nectar phos is diverted from bone meal is this ok for vegan?I don’t know why it’s from bone meal instead of bat guano is it newer or just a diff kind?
Natures Nectar Phosphorous contains no bone meal. Only fossilized bat guano which has been masterfully refined to a clear odorless liquid. This liquid now contains only the mineral content and is devoid of any living organisms. Under chemical analysis it’s closer to lignite than guano, and that’s why it qualifies as veganic…:-)
iv been trying to put up a pic of my bottle but it says diverted from bone meal and its 0-2-0 instead of the 0-4-0
I think that’s a pretty old batch. It’s now DERIVED from fossilized guano and rated 0-4-0…:-)
Ok we’ll that makes sense do you think it will be ok or is there shelf life on them have no idea and do you think it’s vegan considering that its bone meal I have not opened it yet so don’t know what it looks like let me know thank you and if its no good what els you suggest for phos?
You can also use Humboldt Nutrients Bloom 0-10-0
I wouldn’t hold it against you if you used it. As long as it doesn’t have an aweful strong smell…:-)
Lol thank u kyle I mite try it out but I’m prob going to look in to humboldt can’t wait for ur nutes to come out make my life a lot easier
I spoke to EZ-Grow the manufacturers of Natures Nectar and they confirmed what I said yesterday. The product is “ancient” in their words….:-)
Lol “ancient” that sucks well I’m def going to get humboldt for sure then and thanks for doing that kyle ur truly a good person bro
Does sensizyme work well with hygrozyme kyle and when should I use my diamond black
Yes, using both together at half strength each works great. Diamond Black can be used with every watering through mid-flowering. I would look for a product with a higher concentration(%) of humic…:-)
What product do u suggest other then diamond black would be helpfull
Here’s a link to an effective, economical Humic acid. http://safergro.com/product2/humax.htm
I really like Bio-Ag’s Ful-Power Fulvic Acid. Although they’re products are a little pricey. http://www.bioag.com/buycropproducts/faqforhumicacids.html
rite on thank you kyle and should i get both or just the one and use it as i would of the diamond black
Humic acid is used to condition the soil to more easily release the nutrients the media is holding. Fulvic acid is a much smaller, more highly refined humic acid molecule. It can actually be absorbed by the plant and helps facilitate the uptake of nutrients. Both make your nutrients more effective…:-)
U think the grotek humic and fulvic acid is ok
I’ve never heard of that brand, so I can’t recommend it…:-)
Ok cool was just checking how bout AN enggys F-1 and H2
Grandma Engy’s products are fantastic…but expensive…:-)
Kool are they as expensive as bio-ag I will prob give the AN grandma ago as I should be able to get two maybe three harvest in befor your products come out some I’m going to try and get the best vegan medicine with stuff I can get where I live as I do not like ordering stuff online but for ur stuff don’t matter how I get it as long as I get it lmao:D and when u think I should feed with f-1 and h2
Use the humic and fulvic with every watering. Start at the lowest application rate on the bottle. Increase the dosage as you increase their food. Plan to use the highest application rate of the humic and fulvic to coincide with the heaviest feedings….:-)
Ok sounds good and what are there other nutes u use for every watering like from seed/clones all the way to harvest can u list then for me so ino for sure it would be most helpful kyle
I was wondering why use 2 enzymes like prozyme and hygrozyme? do they offer different benefits as opposed to just one? ive only been using the hygorzyme at just under full strength for each watering…better results if I incorporate both at half strength?
I use the same nutes throughout. right now that means nothing but VEGAMATRIX. I’m trying my hardest to get it released ASAP.
Every enzyme has different specialtys. Just like beneficial microbes. So the more diverse your products are, the more bases you cover…;-)
Hey Kyle I have a concern about over feeding with veganic nutrients I got a momma plant it was under a t5 in vegitive growth the last week it was under I gave it og tea 2 tblsp a gal, full bio vega,bio rhizo ,cannazyme at full dosage ,mineral matrix at full dosage ,go calmg full dosage and I augmented with full dosage of natures nectar nitrogen and full dosage of nn potassium I’m 4 days into flower and I’m starting to get inter-veinal browning an small brown rust spots on my top leaves and there starting to loose color to a lime green like I said I’m at full dosage of go cal mg at 10 ml a gal should I just give it the OG tea for 2 waterings then starting feeding again I think it might be an over feed my soil ph is 6.5 on dot checked it with the iq150 ph meter so i know its not the ph just not sure if its too much or not enough!!! the help would be greatly appreciated:(((
And I just started running co2 this week also like I said just trying to get use to if its an overfeed or under feed with this problem I also have the veil scout direct soil ec meter for spec meters would it register it there’s to many nutrients In the medium like I said its all veganic thanks brotha can’t wait for your nutrient vegamatrix to be released hope u can help me out with this problem??!!:)
I think you overdid the micro’s. You shouldn’t need Mineral Matrix until flowering, except for maybe a few drops/gal. Also full strength CAMg under T-5’s? Full strength nutes plus adding Natures Nectar is also high for a transitional formula. This level of food is better suited for mid flowering.
Give them a flush with just OG-Tea and zyme.
Also, if you’re growing in coco, then your pH is too high. I’ve recently found out that cococ requires a slightly lower pH. Around 5.8-6.0
Start pH’ing at 5.8, even the flush, It would be nice to know what your EC meter reads, both nute solution and in the soil…:-)
Just wanted to say nuff respect to everyone here on the forum & to Kyle for being such a helpful & introspective person man. You truly are an inspiration. Veganix are changing the game slowly but surely! BTW, you guys should try come out to the Toronto Treating Yourself Expo this May or June. Get these guys out here on some Veganics!
Thanks JC for the kind words and for being part of the new Veganic Cannaculture Movement…:-)
hey Kyle you ever use the Synergy made by the same company that puts out the Mineral Matrix?? also not sure if its a benefit or not..but started brewing my bio-ag humic/fulvic with my micros..is this a good/bad/neutral thing???
was wondering too,,,I know your using the vegamatrix..would you still indorse the bio-canna line..? is it still a good nutrient to use? read up top you said they needed help? just wanna make sure its still a good product to use..only using it because thats what you taught me..one more..are there any salt residues that can build up through a veg/flower cycle using veganics? I suppose im not 100% vegan..I ammend with a little b-1, honey es, bio-ag, …. the only products in my regimen that do not say veaganic? oh and a so called expert tried to tell me that when my micros die they leave a salt residue..and I should still be flushing a couple times throughout my grow…hope you are able to answer this bro..
Bio genesis Synergy is an awesome product. It would go well with Bio Canna, still the best veganic nutrient available. For now…
It just needs to be amended with several products. Natures Nectar for added nitrogen. I recommend a bloom boost of added phosphorous(Humboldt Nutrients Organic Bloom 0-10-0 + Soluable seaweed 1-1-16), also CaMg and some beneficial microbes…:-)
ahh yes..just wondering..yes ive been using it since i started using the bio-canna line..dont think Ive ever heard you speak about it or not..but when I got the matrix..the synergy was rite next to it, been using them both ever since….anywho..yes Mawn, I have the Canna sched down broham…I understand now what you meant by the bio-canna needing help…I took it like you were sayin the company was going under or something…i chose to use the trio of natures nectar for amendments, and yes the SS by technaflora..B1, cal mag, protek,hygro,bio-ag ,my micros and myan..h-honey es..and I flush with hygro, and blue agave lite color
I tested the Bio Genesis line in my lab King, I used G.O. as my base, I was impressed. Dropped G.O. Bio Bud for Synergy, used Cannas bio boost and Kyle’s week 3-6 veganic bloom booster technique, try the high tide as well it rocks. But synergy is very special. And cmon Frank Zappa is there logo ~~~;-) I love Veganics, its a wonderful new world of cultivating. Im SERIOUSLY ready for the VegaMatrix though, you’ve been teasing me for way to long. Were gonna have a thumb war next time I see you for it. ~~~;-) Thumb is in the Gym getting buffed up, WATCH OUT
Latest and FINAL batch is finally going into testing. It won’t be long now…:-)
My buddy was recently gifted some samplers of Earth Juice OilyCann which is an organic CaMg + humic acid, was wondering if people have tried this product or if they can tell me if its considered veganic or not. My buddy wants to give it a shot on his blackberry x chocolate kush’s.
Here’s all the info I can find from the manufacturer:
“OilyCann™ – A Natural Liquid Calcium, Magnesium & Humic Acid Supplement formulated with ZERO Nitrogen. Horticulturally engineered for Indoor- Outdoor Plants, Hydroponic & Soil Gardening. Can be used alone or together with liquid & dry fertilizers. Recommend for plants with Calcium & Magnesium deficiencies. OilyCann will also aid in buffering water with higher levels of sodium.”
I hate to make you repeat yourself 900 times but I think I might be confused, so if I were putting together a shopping list of required nutes to hold me over until September 30th does this look good or am I missing something obvious?
Mannamix soil
Natures Nectar N, P, K
Humboldt Prozyme, Bloom
Technaflora Soluble Seaweed (extract right?)
Canna bio-boost
Mineral Matrix
OG Tea (The Special Sauce right?)
Sorry again to make you beat this like a drum, thanks for the info and the great meds from B&R. LOVE that you guys made the GSC clones available to us.
*edit* I have plenty of Botanicare cal mag
Shopping list looks great, I would start off using calmag and wait until mid bloom to see if your gonna need the mineral matrix. OG Tea special sauce, Yes Extract 1-1-16. But other than that your solid ~~~;-D If you need more help like when to use each product just let us know. One Luv- Team Kushman
There’s a special section in heaven or Olympus for those who help (for the umpteenth time) us commonfolk with our mundane problems haha thanks fella much appreciated! I’ll definitely be sure to turn to you folks for help when everything is setup and settled in better. Hopefully before you awaken to the danger of the volume of questions I’ll ask haha. Any tips on the Girl Scout Cookies at B&R? Any finicky tendencies or unusual demands I should expect?
Very kind words Tony, and your very welcome, let us know if you need anything Grow Bro, Dr. Kushman and the Team will be here for you ~~~;-D And I’m sure when he gets back he will have a few tips on the girl scout cookies for ya.
I’m going to have a bit of free time and figured I’d do some planning. Since you offered, if you get a chance I’d be interested in your suggestions on best feeding schedules with the list I have. In Manna mix, in 7 gallon fabric pots. Thanks again!
*Odd, Prozyme is the only bottle that wasn’t sealed and tapped shut for shipping*
Should I start giving flowering nutes the week before veg ends or the week AFTER veg ends? I’d still greatly appreciate a recommended feeding schedule. When should I use Bio boost? And for a transitional feeding schedule when should I taper off veg nutes (and how low should the amounts stay?)
Stay on your full strength vegging formula for the first week of flowering. Then switch to a transition formula by combining equal amounts of grow and bloom. Then switch to high phosphorous from the second week of flowering.
For an added BOOST, I liked to start using the Bio-Boost during the last week of veg. Rather than waiting until the plants start to show flowers as their directions suggest.
Sorry I’ve been away so long. But I’m back and I’ll try to make myself available every day…:-)
Hey kyle I was just wondering when I can buy vega matrix nutes I was just reading the January issue and the article on buds N roses and it said u released it in October but I can’t find where to buy it
Vegamatrix is now available at local hydro stores and always available at Greners.com to order online.
I recently picked up the vegamatrix line and was wondering if I should be adding any humic of fulvic along with both zymes.
Kyle had fulvic, humic and aminos added to the VegaMatrix line up for us so we wouldn’t have to buy additional products or bottles. Give the VegaMatrix line up a first go around before adding any additional additives.
on water days what am i adding to the water? primezyme and og tea? Ive always FFW. thank you!
OGC, I’m sorry, not really sure I understand the question GroBro? Please explain I might be over medicated ~~~;-P
do you feed everyday? or do you feed feed water? and if you do water days what do you add to the water?
I see what your saying, I do not feed every day, Its good to let your plants have a day or two to absorb the nutrients and let the roots dry a lil bit so that they breathe. With Vegamatrix you can feed every watering, Vegamatrix is a non burning formula :-), I will give a plain water feeding mid way through veg and also midway through bloom as well, just a plain water flush ph’d to around 6.0 or your liking for the type of soil or soilless you are using.
thanks braveheart!! ill come to you with some more questions soon enough! you the man!
Hey Kyle, I dig the pic at the top of the thread, what type of light do you flower under? Thanks
